Repeatability Is Scalability — Ashlan Glazier-Anderson

Ashlan Glazier-Anderson runs a marketing agency and co-hosts the Take the Leap podcast. Her comfort watch — the entire Jurassic Park/Jurassic World universe — sets up a conversation about avoiding the same mistakes on repeat and building systems that actually scale.

In this episode:

• Why Ashlan directly asks prospects and clients for the work she wants, instead of waiting
• Her milestone timeline: from paying herself back her startup costs to fully replacing her W-2 income
• The client red flags that are now instant no's
• What she pays for health insurance, and the bronze-plan trade-offs of self-employment
• Why "repeatability is scalability" and how templatizing her process changed her business

Connect with Ashlan Glazier-Anderson:
Ashlan is the founder + CEO of AshbeanPDX, a marketing and communications agency partnering with nonprofits and small businesses making a positive impact in their communities. With 20+ years across agencies, corporations, and nonprofits, she audits what's already working for a client and builds on it — pairing deep marketing strategy with serious technical chops, and working alongside existing teams instead of replacing them. She holds a Master's in Strategic Communications from the University of Oregon and is a Professional Certified Marketer and Certified Digital Marketing Professional. Born in Hawaii, raised in Oregon, now soaking up the sun in Las Vegas with her husband, Jon, and their senior dog, Ahri.

🌐 Website: http://ashbeanpdx.com
📱 Follow: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ashlan-glazier-anderson/

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This season was produced and edited by Mary Williams through Sensible Woo and Sasquatch Media Grounds, out of Vancouver, WA.

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Welcome to the School of Moxie podcast. I'm your host, Mary Williams. This season, we're talking about one thing, my business pays for my life. We're not talking about side hustles or someday dreams. We're talking about businesses that actually pay for your life, so your rent and your mortgage, your health insurance premium, the whole kit and caboodle. The thing you are not going to get today in this episode, you are not going to hear my guest read their resume at you for 15 minutes. We're skipping the highlight reel and going straight to the good stuff. We're talking about timelines and trade-offs and the money conversations that not enough people are talking about out loud, but we're about to do it here on this show. If you want to know all the details about who this person is and what they do, that's what the show notes are for. Go check them out. Follow their links. Please support their work because you don't really get to know somebody from just one episode. You get to know them by showing up for their work day after day. That's what they've done for their own communities, and it's what I'm asking you to do for them. All right, let's get into it. Ashlan, we're back on the air. You were episode number one on season one of School of Moxie, and I've been on yours and Tory's podcast three times. Three times. Every single season. Always, always in the very beginning. Usually we're like, "We're doing this again. Are you coming back?" I love every time. Yes. Yes. The answer is yes. Um, well, you and I have been on here so many… We have had so many recorded conversations, and I'm so excited that you're doing this final season with me, because there really weren't a whole lot of you that answered the casting call and were able to really verify, "My business pays for my life." In the course of doing those two seasons, so many people were like, "Oh, can you do this show? Can you do that show?" And I kept thinking, "That's an interesting choice. Like, what does that mean to you?" And, you know, I've really come to realize that the things we love for water cooler chat really tell us a lot about us and how we operate and our values. So I am wondering for you, would you please tell us what you have chosen as your comfort watch title? Uh, Jurassic Park, Jurassic World, the Jura- the, the dinosaur universe is what I've much. Um, because no matter how, quote-unquote, bad of a review they get, I will always watch them because it's just a thing. So Did you see the most recent one with Jonathan Bailey and his slutty little glasses? Mm-hmm. The museum curator. Yeah. I don't know who greenlit that script. I mean, it was bad. Girl, it was bad. But did I watch it? Yes. Yes, I did. Of course. Of course. Yeah, the whole, the family th- the, the family that's running on the side. Like, it was, it was like, let's just throw all this stuff in and just see what happens. Oh, poor Scarlett Johansson. You could just see the subtext in her brain like, "I'm getting paid. I'm getting paid." Yep, yep. Which her character in that too was Getting paid. Excellent acting job. She should win an Oscar. Mm-hmm. Well, why do you keep going back to the Jurassic Park, Jurassic World universe? Like, what is it about dinosaurs, other than the fact that dinosaurs are cool and we love them, but like, why? Yeah. I have been obsessed with dinosaurs with s- since I was little. Um, I wish I knew… Like, my mom bought us dinosaur books. It's just been a thing. Um, I actually thought when I was younger that I was going to be a pale- like, I wanted to be a paleontologist, a, you know, archeologist, and then I started looking into, uh, what a career in that, you know, requires, and I was like, "God, you don't really find very much stuff, and you're just in the middle of the desert di- you know, like, just digging in dirt." And I was like, "Eh, d- am I really built for th- no, I'm not really built for this." It's not Jur- it's not gonna be Jurassic Park. It's gonna be you're in dust and dirt every single day. And, uh, guessing how the puzzle piece goes back together. So, so yeah, that wasn't gonna be the thing. But I keep… It's so funny 'cause, like, the more and more I watch it, even now that I'm a business owner, there's so many things and so many clues. One, you know, uh, the very first one, Nedry's character, um, I just will always remember him as, uh, from Seinfeld when he was playing Risk on the train. Uh, Newman. I will always He's Newman. though that's not… Yeah, it… And he always, I feel like he always gets typecast as a character in everything. But one, giving people all the keys to your fucking castle, you know, because we know. We know business owners who have done that Oh, yes. And they do end up with a Newman. They do end up with a Newman situation, and sadly it's not satisfying like in the original Jurassic Park. The dinosaurs do not eat him. They, they… The person just runs off with the keys to your kingdom, Uh-huh. to be seen again We've just been rewatching"Schitt's Creek" and it-- that's how it starts out too. The, "We thought everything was fine." Um, so yeah. So I think as business owner, you know, like, as business owners, there's that element. Um, I think the second one is making the same mistakes over and over again. Like, you have these killing machines, and you just decide to put them around people, you know? And also, I feel like the more and more they go on, like, all the technology things, like, ugh, I'm sure you, you and I talk, we, we know AI everything now. There's proper ways to use it. I feel like there's improper ways to use it. I have started saving, um, 'cause my big thing now is, like, stop letting AI design your flyers. I've started saving some of them so I can show, like, "See this right here? Th- there's all these clues, all these signals," and people are not trusting stuff that is created by AI. Like, it just, you know, there's this trust recession that's happening right now. Um, so yeah. So I think that, you know, those pieces of, like, why do you keep… And I think business owners do this the same too. Why do you keep doing the thing that is either driving you crazy, that is, um, not working out? Like, you're putting all your eggs in this basket again, and it's just like, "Let me just try this, like, a bajillion times." Like, girl, try something It's like maybe this time, actually reminds me of people's dating habits, 'cause you know how I feel about business and dating. It's like maybe this time they'll be different, and it's like, girl, no. How many, how many more How many times? to circle around this mess again? But yeah, you would think that with dinosaur-killing machines and technology that always goes bad that they would have learned by now don't resurrect the dinosaurs, but they do But they do over and over again, and I will continue to watch it even though it is literally, it's the… Well, I mean, and it's human life, right?'Cause I feel like we're doing that in our country in, like, so many things that are happening. Like, did we not learn? Did we not learn, um… Oh, what was it? I've been on, like, an older, like, re-watching older movies kick. Um, I think it was Hot Shots! Part Deux, which, you know, has Charlie Sheen in it, and, like, they get- one of the guys goes into, like, his little, um, fighter plane, and he's like, "I figured out how to solve climate cha- like, climate change or global warming." And he's, like, the first guy that dies. I'm just like, "Oh, it's been a joke since, like, the early '90s." yeah. Also, I have not heard someone say Hot Shots Part Deux in forever, and I love you so much for that, 'cause we did not talk about that before recording. Nope. Nope. Nope. Yeah. You know, Top Gun, every… Like, I don't know. I go sometimes, like, down rabbit holes of watching old stuff just 'cause it's, it's fun and it's nostalgic. But yeah, it has a lot of undertones of, like, maybe there is something wrong with us as humans that we're like, "We'll just give it another go." But we fall into these, like, patterns and habits, and I feel like sometimes it takes so much to break it. Like, I'm guilty of it, too, you know, not listening to the yellow and red flags in, like, client relationships. I finally had to tell people in my BNI group, like, "These are the folks that I do not wanna work with." If they are desperate and their last thing is that they wanna pay a marketing agency to try to make something work, and they don't take any responsibility for them- themselves not being able to sell, or they don't know their fricking numbers. Because if I look in s- you know, under the hood of somebody again and see that they were making almost a million dollars and had no idea how much they were spending on advertising to get to that number, and then giving me a fraction of the budget, yeah, I don't wanna work with people like that anymore. And them being like, "Oh, it's not working." And I'm like, "You know what? For, like, that little budget, I got you, uh, one less lead than that person did last year." So it's not that. So yeah. I think it's so interesting that you're talking about "Jurassic Park" because, um, it's such a great example of plenty of m- media material that will remind you about don't do this folly right here again, and again, and again. And in our world, it's like the movie has been played over and over. People tell their stories, they write books about it, they make podcasts about it. Like, I mean, there's so much a- with this material in play and, and yet we forget in the moment, and maybe that is like a human foible. But, um, but also I think you're pointing out something really important, which is trusted community who will hold your feet to the fire and remind you when you need to be reminded, because sometimes you are, like, just so much in the work that you forget. And in the case of "Jurassic Park," they're just so much into their bad science that they forget, "Oh, no, maybe cloning that again is a bad idea." Yeah. But at the same time, because we have so many billionaires and now a trillionaire in this country, I'm like, "Where the fuck are my dinosaurs? Where, where are they?" I remember there was a long time ago they were trying to, like, do the wooly mammoth DNA Oh, I remember that. where did that g- where did Where did that go? you Maybe they're secretly being developed, and then you'll just see them charge a field one day. You'll be like, "Yes." Be like, "Oh, there they are." Yes. Open wo- or open world zoo, you know? Enter at your own risk. I keep thinking like bring back a saber-toothed tiger, tiger because the cat in me is like, "I want a cat. Bring back the cat. Bring back the really big cat with the really big teeth." With the really big teeth. Yeah. Yeah. Oh my God, that's so awesome. Um, well, I mean, you have clearly avoided a lot of Jurassic Park related problems in your business journey because your business legit pays for your life. Like, I asked all of you some pretty detailed questions, and I was like, "We're not gonna do the numbers and stuff on this podcast. There are other podcasts that do that." I was like, "That's not the important part." But, you know, the important part is celebrating that this is a milestone that we just sort of… I don't know. I know that we agree on this. I'm sure there's other people who do too, but, um, we sort of gloss over it in our business journey. Like, there are other things that people celebrate more, like how many followers you have or how much revenue you generated, which is a great number, but if you generate revenue but it can't pay for your life, like, there's still a problem there. That's not sustainable. So I'm wondering for you, at what point did you realize that your business really was paying for your life? Like, I feel like I kind of know 'cause I've been so close to you watching you do it, but, like, how long did it take for you to really get to that milestone? Because I feel like people kind of wobble a little, little bit on their way to crossing over that line, and so then they will dog on themselves like, "Oh no, I did it. I didn't do it. I did it. I didn't do it." Yep. So, um, the kind of the first milestone was nine months after starting. So I started in January of 2021. By September, what I did was I paid myself back everything I had put into the business, so, so that I was at ze- you know, like zero basically. So I was just like, "Hey, I invested that. I'm giving that back to…" I wasn't paying myself a paycheck yet, but I was like, "I'm gonna give myself back all the money that I put in to start this." And then anything that was made basically by the business, all the software programs, everything that was required for it, you know, QuickBooks, all those different things paid for by the business, and then some, because that was when I hired somebody and my first part-time person. Um, so that was kind of milestone one, but it wasn't enough to, like, pay me. It didn't take that much longer to get to milestone two, which was 15 months in, so March of the next year. I basically told my job, uh, that, "I don't need you in, in my, my full-time W2. I don't need you anymore." Um, because I had gone to my clients. I was like, "Hey, I'm thinking about quitting my job. Do y'all have more money for me?" Um, and so they did. And so, yeah. So by m- 15 months in, I was able to do that. And I took a damn vacation to Hawaii for like three weeks in the middle of that, um, where I was working part-time, but I, you know, was enough. And then June of 2022, it was like, "Okay, this is it. Don't have a pay- don't have a paycheck to fall back on. It is all you." Um, so yeah. So I would say with focus, grit, working my ass off, you know, telling everybody, "Hey, I have this now. Who can you send to me?" That was enough. And then, um, yeah, I landed two big clients right after that, and the rest was history. I have to say, one of the things I have always so admired you for, and you have modeled it so well, is how you will go out and ask people directly. You will ask them, like, "Do you have this? I am ready for this. Is that you?" And I love that about you so much, and, um, I feel like for anybody listening, um, if there is Ashlan your- herself or somebody similar to, like, not, not fall out of contact with that person, because I feel like people like you are, um, are actually really quite rare. I Thank you. I mean, I don't feel like I'm f- I don't feel like I'm very good at asking people. I'm good at attracting people. I'm good at teasing an audience and tr- and attracting, and so, like, I'll just attract more numbers, but, like, I'm trying to get better in this season of just, like, approaching people and being like, "Hey, I have this thing. Like, is this you?" You know? And, um, especially in this lovely crunchy economy right now, um, maybe, maybe that's, like, a really great lesson to be learned and, um, a great way to avoid repeating Jurassic Park problems perhaps. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. What I think too, it's just the adaptation. Like, my business is so different than… Like, like, not really, but really different than when I started, you know what I mean? When I started out. Like, I don't do some of the same things. I, you know, present things in a different way. Actually, my new thing that I'm putting out there, um, because I wanna kinda like avoid the folks that I don't wanna work with, is, um, leading with, like, content strategy that really I understand your audience, what we need to put in front of them to know, like, and trust you, and then having the engine that continues to drip that out and continues to have that. And so I'm having really solid conversations with my clients. Um, like I have one client who's a fractional CFO. We talk for 30 minutes a month. I report numbers. I get his perspective on things, and then I'm posting all his LinkedIn content, and it's getting people liking and commenting and following and interacting. But the grand scheme of things is I'm able to write that because I am interviewing and understanding what makes him unique, what is gonna make people want to follow him. I'm also now looking at, like, what other fractional CFOs are talking about and being like, "How can we differentiate ourselves from them?" Because I'll be honest, a ton of them, and I've been looking at this with business coaches too, I'm like, "Ooh, I can tell from your words you are just taking whatever the fuck chat tells you to say in your space, and you're not feeding it that uniqueness that is you." Yeah. And it's bad. It is bad. You can spot it now really, really easily, very quickly. Yep. ugh. Well, do you feel like, um, anything changed when you did realize that your business became responsible for supporting your life? Oh, what changed? Uh, I freaked out a little bit because I was like, "Oh God, like if, if any of these clients leave, like, what am I gonna do?" Um, but that's why I have never… I've, I've always said I have openings or now, I mean, now I'm kind of building like a wait list for people of like, "This is when I can start working with you." Yes. like, like, "I love that you wanna work with me, but like I need to wrap some stuff up first and able to, in, in order to do that." Um, and I think one of the glorious things too is the majority of the clients that I had in Portland are still with me. So one of the things I really value is like I'm still working with my first retainer client even now. You know? So there's something secret saucy in there. Or I was up in, in San Francisco last week with a client who was in that June 2022 bucket, and he was telling me, he was like, "Gosh, you are the longest marketing company that I've worked with." And so I like kinda grilled him. I was like, "Why? Why do you stay with me? Like, what's wrong, you know, what's wrong with the others?" And um, one of the things that he did say was like, "You pivot. You're will-" He's like, he-- I was glad he was really honest with me. He's like, "Your strength can also be one of your weaknesses," because I like to try and do new things. And so, and you know, AD- he admittedly has ADHD. I know that I have some version of, you know, some type of it. And he's like, "I love that you're able to just take stuff and run with it and like help me outline all of this." But he was just like, "But also sometimes you don't be like, 'Oh, maybe we shouldn't do that.'" And I was like, "Yeah, I'm always gonna be like,'Yeah, let's go do the fun thing.'" You know? Because none of the other stuff goes away. We just get to play with the fun things, Yes. Yeah, I think now is the season 'cause there's so much disrupt- disruption in the marketplace right now, and now is absolutely the season to, if some-- to follow the things that have some natural flow to them. There's not a whole lot of resistance, and it's like, and they're creative and they're fun, and they'll make you money. Like, go try it, you know? Yeah. Oh, I love that. That's so good. Um, do you feel like you work more than some of your peers? Yes. Yes and no.'Cause like a, a lot of people are like, "Oh God, it feels-- I feel like you're working all the time." I was like, "I also go on vacation." Like, I am really… We had-- You know this. We had so much fun at EDC. Um, we already have tickets for next year. So like, I do know how to let-- have fun. I do know how to like take vacation and time off. But, you know, being a hu- the human design generator that I am, I don't, I don't need the same recovery space that some other… Yeah, that my lovely manifestors need. You know? And so as long as I'm doing what I wanna do, what I love doing, you will, you will see me here. Like, every time when people are like,"Oh, the podcast," you know, "Oh, you must spend so long doing that." I was like, "I love it. It is a labor of love." Like, I thought about like handing off editing to somebody else, and I was like, you know what? It took me so long to get used to listening to my own voice. Like, why would I give that away? You know? Okay, this is a question that I have been asking everybody this season because it's my own morbid curiosity to make me feel better about my healthcare premium. How much do you pay for health insurance, Ashlan? I believe for both of us it's 583, but it is the lowest bottom of the barrel insurance. So like, uh, we have, is it an 18-- It's an $18,000 deductible. shit. Sorry. yeah. So preventative is covered, however, catastrophic is not. So, you know, but we're relatively healthy people, That, that is amazing. The answers have varied widely. Some of us in our cohort for this season are paying, relatively low prices, for very high deductibles, and, paying out of pocket for the rest. And then a lot of us are paying more for deduct- or more for our premiums and getting just sort of like standard, regular, what you would expect in a corporate W2 job, silver plan. But we, we have to pay for this bill and I feel like there's a lot of people who either don't take the leap out of… Speaking of taking the leap, ha ha, that's my pun for you. Um, that's the name of your show. And, and so they don't take the leap out of their nine-to-five, or they, maybe don't want to get out of some of these golden coffin situations where another system is subsidizing that. Totally. Well, and I think too, like, um, we might not be doing that in the future. I've been learning so many things here in Las Vegas. So there is a big concierge doctor community where you can pay cash, but that cash amount that you would pay is actually a lot less than they would charge insurance. And so, like, that's definitely something. And then there was another, um, if I join one of the chambers of commerce, they have a group health policy in it. So I'm just waiting, um, I'm just waiting to hear back from, like, one of their membership people, 'cause I was like,"No rush in getting back to me. This is on the 2027 budget." But, you know, like just being prepared for things like that because yeah, that's a-- I mean, you know, the fact that both of us are covered is pretty dang good for that amount of money. But it's still, you know, I've never… This is the first time I've bronze planned in my entire life. I've always had silver, gold, or platinum, you know, the, the platinum plan. Like, oh, when I paid, when I worked at nonprofits, man, so much shit was covered. It was like, you know, that would've been the time to, like, if we were actually having children, like have a baby and do all year. I'm paying 731 and change every month for premium, and I think I have an $8,000 deductible, which by all intents and purposes is a pretty fucking good plan. It's a silver plan with Blue Cross, but I was like, for that money, I'm like, I'm getting everything. I got my colonoscopy. I got my mammogram. I'm like, I'm doing everything. I'm going to the dermatologist. I see my doctor every three months to work on the chronic health things that I've been working on for a long time, and I'm like, I'm gonna use the crap out of this plan. Yep, yep. Yeah. I've been really lucky. I mean, you know, and I've been on my, like, health journey this, this year, or started last year with starting GLP-1s and then, like, doing the strength training this year. So, like, luckily haven't had anything, knock on all the wood everywhere, major happen. Yeah. Um, but yeah, so it's been, been pretty good here. All the wood. All the wood. But yeah. Yeah. Oh my god. Well, thank you for answering that question, 'cause it just keeps adding to this picture for everybody as they listen to all, uh, everybody this season, which is so great.

Um, the next question: 23:50

What have you given up in order to build a business that fully supports your life?'Cause everybody gives up something I don't think that's giving something up. Maybe I can answer this in a different way. Like, I don't have a commute, I don't have to commute anywhere anymore. I don't have to deal with that. But maybe, you know, maybe one thing actually is, you know, when you work in a normal nine-to-five, depending on who your leadership team is, there's a lot of built-in things that you don't realize afterwards. Like, maybe there was, like, an internal leadership professional development program or, you know, you had mentors and sponsors. Like, now you gotta look for business coaches, or Mary, you've always been my, like, coach in my back pocket when I need stuff. With like, she'll wake up to a WhatsApp message of like, "This is what I'm dealing with right now." Love it. you get this, can you help me?" I know. I forget all the time, and I should just, I should just have, like, a once a week, like, "Mary, this is what, what's happening," kind of message. But, you know, like, those are the kind of things that you, you have to build in for yourself as a business owner. You have to choose the type of profession… Like, if you're not doing any professional development as a business owner, shame on you. You, uh, I believe in lifelong learning. Learner is one of my, like, CliftonStrengths things. Like, I feel like I see the businesses that don't do well are the ones that are like, "Why? Oh, why is this not working? I've been doing the same thing I've been doing for the last 15 years." And it's like, yeah, 'cause this is not the world of 15 years ago, girl. This is not, this is just not it. That's, you know, everything has changed post-COVID, and again, you know, in what we're dealing with, um, right now. But yeah, so I think that is one thing, you know. There, there are no special, like, tuition reimbursements and things that you can take advantage of. You know what you're describing though is natural curiosity. You are naturally curious, and when you work in a corporate job where they give you professional development or they kind of force you to go to trainings, you're kind of forced to be curious. Or they have a lunchtime lecture and you get, like, the peer pressure to go bring your lunch and go sit. And you're kind of, you're, like, kind of put into an environment where they foster it because it makes their workforce better by you doing that. And I think you're right. Like, people who don't do lifelong learning, you do see it in their business development. Like, their business development is not good. And, and, and it's because they're not as cur- like, naturally curious. Like, you've gotta figure out, how do I find my natural curiosity? And I mean, I mean, you know, you and I both agree on this. It's like, if you're not naturally curious and you don't like the boring parts of the business development process, like, maybe a W2 job really is the happier place for you because it's so hard to run a business. Like, why put yourself through the torture device if you don't like it? You know? Yep. It like being stretched on the rack, you Yes. I was just thinking stretch, it's gonna stretch you. All I could think was like, "Oh, I could use a really good stretch right now." Don't think that's what that was built for, but I'm like, "Can you just stretch me out?" I saw a meme the other day, and they were, and it was, like, a old picture, you know, from, like, the Middle Ages, like an etching of somebody on the rack being stretched. And they're like, "I bet there's this, like, one, this one moment though when it feels really good." And it's like, yeah, I sit at my desk a lot. again, in the tour of old movies, The Addams Family, he puts her I love it. so you have described so many things for us, and I am wondering because you are the primary breadwinner in your house, um, you know, you've gone through your whole journey. Like, do you ever genuinely feel the weight of knowing that this is all on you? Yes. All, uh, uh, yeah. Yes. And you know what I always fall back on is, you did it before, you can do it again. Like, that's, you know, like, um, that is something that anytime I have that little voice like, "Oh my God, it's gonna be bad," or, you know, when I got the news that one of my major… Like, they were so kind to tell me so Yeah. Um, one of my major clie- like, my major clients, um, that was, what percentage would that have been of my monthly? Very good, like, quarter of what I ma- like, 25% of my monthly recurring revenue, um, was going away. They told, they gave me a seven-month runway. They were like, "We're gonna keep you the entire time. Here's how things are gonna need to adjust while we're figuring out these months. Like, these, this is gonna be, you know, shorter hours here, but we're assuming that it's gonna be more, you know, more hours on the back end, especially if we need a lot of help out." Um, so that was very kind of them, but, you know, at the time I had two employees and I was like,"If we cannot replace this, I am so sorry. Like, you, uh, have got to go." And neither of them wanted to help with this stuff. So, like, I was just like, that's, you know. I think that that is the main difference between a W2 employee and a business owner, is you are always selling, even if you don't realize it. Even this is, this, even though it is not direct selling, this is selling. This is visibility. This is authority. This is credibility. This is expertise. Like, this still is part of your sales process, and folks who are W2s, like, I would challenge you to think about it. When is the last time that you did something to help the business that you are working for? You know, that's Oof. Yeah, all content is sales. And, um, also when I teach sales to people, I remind them, you sell your significant other on the plan that you wanna have. Like, you just wanna go out to dinner instead of cooking tonight, and they agree to do it, you sold them. Um, if you, you know, sell some leftover kitchen equipment on Facebook Marketplace, you sold a thing. Like, you are selling. You sell all the time. All the time. Sales is one of the things, like, it was pointed out to me before I jumped out, and I wish that I had absorbed the lesson, like, harder, more, because, like, sales is everything. It's sales. Sales and marketing is everything. And that is one of the blessings of having a twen- uh, I think I, I think I took marketing class in 2001. So I've been saying marketing has been a part of my brain for 25 years. Yes. like, Long time, long it's been a long time, and it's changed a lot, but it does come down to that. Marketing is sales enablement, and sales is, you know… Sales doesn't need to be a dirty word. No. No. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, that could be its own… That could be a whole A whole nother episode. Yeah. Yeah. whole thing. Um, okay, so you mentioned you have this client, you lost 25% of your revenue, but I've been asking everybody this season, if you lost 50% of your revenue suddenly overnight, 'cause this is happening to a lot of people. AI is very disruptive right now. We're not gonna pretend like it's not. And, and so it's had a trickle-down effect within, like, the wider economy. And so if you lost 50% of your revenue tomorrow, what's the first thing you would do? Uh, I would ask other people who do something similar to me, "Do you need a hand? Do you need a 1099 contractor? Do you need an account manager? Do you need somebody who can help you out during this time?" So that would be my, my first step. And then, I mean, I have the luxury of living in Las Vegas, so I would look at part-time… I, I am not above taking some part-time work. Um, and, and also going to my BNI group and being like, "Look, y'all. There are 53 other businesses in this room. Yeah. work at your budget level to get, to get some income in." So I'm not above, um, anything other than hooking, you know? Like much community around you though. Like, I'm just, like, trying to highlight… I feel like I'm like, I have a highlighter. I'm, like, highlighting as you talk if I could on the screen. It-- You have community, you have clear, clear understanding and identity of who you are, what you serve, what you do in this market, and, you know, and you're curious and flexible, and there, there is a staying power in that. I mean, when you first leapt out and you were like, "This isn't a side hustle anymore, this is my full-time thing," I mean, you kinda jumped into a world that was pretty rocky, and like, you have thrived. So I, I just, I, I really hope that somebody out there is listening and seeing those highlights too, and realizing like, "Oh, maybe there's some of this I need more of," or something. So we-- you and I have not talked about this, but this, you know, has been one of my goals here in Las Vegas. So in Portland, I was the name to be known, the marketing gal, the, the person you could introduce to. This has been happening to me as I enter rooms, especially rooms that I have never been in before or it's like the first time going there. Um, people will come up to me and say, "So and so told me to come talk to you. Are you Ashlan?" And I will. People are like, "What are-- what is gonna happen if you don't color your hair?" And it's like, "Oh, you, you do not know. This will always be a thing." So like I'm very noticeable because people come up to me and then they ask me if that's who I am. Um, and they'll say, you know, "So and so said I should come talk to you about this." And I was just like, "I love that. I'm gonna text them thank you." And also, I just love that that is what is happening here because that is what used to happen in Portland. And to have that happen, you know, only three years in with like me going back and forth to work, you know, Oregon multiple times, things like that, it feels really great to, to, to have that, that validation that what I am doing is the right thing and that I'm showing up in the right places. But like, I also wanna point out, you get those word-of-mouth referrals because you're a good fucking person. Like, you know? Like, I think there's people and they're like, "Oh, I have community." Like, you see them everywhere. You see them out everywhere, everybody seems to know them, and yet people aren't really referring them, and you know, there's a reason for that. So like, just being social isn't the name of the game. Like, being referable and having people say, "Oh, so- somebody told me to come talk to you," is, um, is really a testament to like having shown up and been supportive of other people and championing, championing them just as much, um, being helpful in the spaces that you show up in, and like also being consistently present and not like dipping in and then leaving for months or years on end and then coming back and being like, "I need business." And it's, you know, people do that on their email newsletter lists too, but they do it in real life too. Yeah. I have learned to really cut people really fast when all it is is, "Help me, help me, help me," but they do not reciprocate the offer, you know? Or, or, uh, even-- And it doesn't need to be like, um, you know, "Promote me, promote me, promote me." It's even just being like, "Hey, how are you?" Like, "What's going on? Can I help you?" But yeah, there's, there's some people in my circle recently that have been, like, having a really hard time with, with business stuff, and I'm like,"You know, I have given you advice. I have said things. Yeah. I'm busy running my own hustle. I can't…" You know what I mean? I can't promote the shit out of you. Like, know. So it's hard, you know? I feel you on that so much. Um, do you feel like there's a business expense nobody ever warned you about? Oh, um, fuck. All the insurances and things, you know. Like, um, I just went to a, a presentation last night about legal, you know, legal shield and legal representation and, you know, kind of batting that around in my head. Vegas likes to sue people. We got personal injury, like, we got lawyers and attorneys on everything here, and so I'm like,"Ugh, do I need something like that?" You know, "Do I want something like that?" So I think, you know, those kinds of things. Um, and then what else? I don't know. Uh, I mean, you know, everybody thinks about, like, the price that you charge for things, and sometimes people are like, "Oh, God, that's really expensive." And I was like, "You know how much software I bring to you? You know that I have a social…" Like, you know, I have a social media scheduling tool in all of this. Like, I almost wanna break out, like… But here's the other thing, though,'cause I was just like, I thought about, like, breaking it out of, like, okay, you know, if you agree to this one where it's, like, lower, y- I'm gonna make you buy the scheduling tool and the, you know, the thing like that. So, like, you know, I know my numbers are good where they're at. Um, but yeah. So I am actually in the process of, um, launching lower ticket workshop style, um, and eventually I think a membership here in Vegas, because a lot of people just don't, don't understand the basics of marketing. And I've, I've heard too many ti- Like, I have the rule of three. If, if three times, you know, in conse- in succession, people are just like, "I would totally pay for that," I have to do it. Like, that's enough it's an, it's enough verbal confirmation. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I, I can confirm for you, as you know, one to many is performing very well at the moment. I think it's just where people, people are at economically at the moment. It feels, it feels emotionally easier to hop into the done with you or, you know, advice given, you know, membership space instead of doing the bigger things. But, um, you know, I think memberships are so great because you can give people confidence to do more with you later. So Absolutely. Yep, it's a value ladder. It's all a value ladder, so I'll just be one of those three. I'll be like, "Yes," verbally. Yes. In this moment, on this recording. Um, what do you think that many entrepreneurs misunderstand about becoming fully self-supporting through their business? Um, that y- that it is hard work. That, you know, you don't… It never stops, but you also need to rest, I guess. So, like, you will… The systems, and you used to be a syst- systems ghost, and I know you're still a systems person. The more that you can create the systems that work for you and your brain and your business, the easier life is going to be. Yes And repeatability is scalability. Um, you know, I've been working with Veronica to, to help templatize, compartmentalize, do all these things because I want things to be a lot easier and not rely on my brain. Um, especially as, you know, I, I am seeing the perimenopause symptoms on the wall. I am Welcome. fog. Welcome. I know. Welcome to you are 40. Um, and so, like, yeah, the more that you can do to set yourself up for success in the beginning. And I think the other thing too is, like, write… I've, I have become so much more reflective in, like, writing things down and, like, looking back at things and being like, "Okay, that was worth my time. That was worth my investment." Um, the woman that I talked to earlier today, she's just like, "Do you really think that that group makes, you know, makes sense?" And it was like, don't sign up for it yet unless you can come to all the things. But I, you know, 'cause I was like, I signed up, I didn't come to my first thing till, you know, signed up in June, didn't come to another thing till July, and then August. They have three events that you can come to every month. And I was like, since I have consistently been showing up at those events and sponsored their summit, I am very well-known in this, you know, this community, and I have people being like, "I, I wanna work with you." So I was like… And I-- her particular business, I was like, I could see it working really well in this group. But I was like, "Don't sign up until you can show up," because they do not reward people who, who come and then leave, and then come and then leave. Like, it just is not gonna be a thing. And then genuinely get to know people before you ask them for anything. So I always try to help out first before I even… I, I wait till they ask, "How do I work with you?" Or, "How much do you cost?" Or what, you know, like, "What would this be to, to do this with you?" I'm not a pushy salesperson at Same. I have been trained in high-ticket sales, high-pressure sales, and, um, and I have been in those sales rooms, and after having had that experience, I'm like, "Nope, that is not how I like to do sales." But yeah, I, I love that you are reminding people, like, wait until you have capacity. Like, do a little reflection. Do I have time for this right now? Um, because I say the same thing. I've had people who've inquired about this, my Studios Dojo that you're a member of too, and, and I'm like… And they're like, "How much time? How many calls?" I'm like, "Well, this is an accountability space, and this is not a busy space, so we're not doing a ton of calls." But I was like, "If you don't have time to even work on any content for yourself, like, wait until you're ready to do something." You know, actively try start doing something or you're actively making something before, you know, you Yeah, I know. And I don't participate in Dojo all the time, but you know I'm making content weekly You know, you're not the only one. You're not the only one. I see all of… I see everything that y'all do, and, um, yeah, I, I love that you don't come all the time because it's a, to me, I see it as a marker of business maturity when you're like, "No, I don't need to be on that call," or, "The replay will be sufficient for this one." And then you come to the stuff where you're like, "I need to be there in person," you know? And, um, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And I like to just follow along what everybody's doing. It's really It's inspiring. It's inspiring. Do you think that business programs, coaches, and communities maybe are not talking about things enough that do keep people stuck in a dependency pattern, speaking of dependency patterns? Yes. I do think that not enough of those spaces create… I'm gonna compare it to something here in Vegas. It's like if you go to a slot machine and you're getting, you know, like strung along by the bright lights and things, I think that there are coaching communities and other things that, that are predatory for people. Like, they are literally giving them the shiny object thing, but not the way to graduate out of it. Um, you know, I, I think that there are folks that don't do the accountability work. They don't, you know, do the check-ins. They don't really-- They, they keep people kind of addicted to the drug without helping them get off of it, if that makes sense. So, so yeah. And, and I do pay really close attention to what the ultimate outcome that you're supposed to get from, from said community program course. There's so-- I feel like there's, like, an information overload out there, and I think a lot of times people… You know, you can get in the space where you're learning what to do, right? And you're, and you're, you're in the knowledge gathering phase. But if you don't ever do the implementation and the execution phase, then what the fuck did you pay for Yes. Yes I do think that there are people who get stuck in the information overwhelm and then never do the execution, and that is-- I wanna brag a little bit on, on, on how I'm planning these workshops and things. There's gonna be pre-work. There's gonna be pre-recorded videos. My expectation is that you watch them before you come. Um, I have a friend who's helping me get an in-person workshop space, so the first 30 minutes are gonna be, like, open networking, or I'm gonna say,"Don't show up to this first 30 minutes. Watch the shit." And then this is when the actual program starts, because what we are going to do is take action on what you learned, and you're gonna get to ask your questions about that, because I don't like that people consume, consume, consume and never do an act. Like, it just-- And I think that that is a problem in that world because it's just, "Here's my new widget fancy thing," or, "My $27 thing." And I'm like, how many-- And I'm guilty of this, too. How many more downloads are you gonna have where you don't actually use the content? Yep. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. I, I wholeheartedly agree with you. I feel like we are in a very, very early stage at the moment, and the reason why I included that question this season is because personally, I feel like we're in an early stage where we're about to see that old model really fall apart because people are like,"But what do I have to show for it?" And, and, and it doesn't seem as sexy to pay for, in quotes, nothing. Like, there's no library of stuff, and it's like, no, what you've paid for is execution and putting things into motion, and sometimes those things aren't always visible. Um, sometimes they are just, you know, things that have to be, I don't know, published. Mm-hmm. But, like, the act of publishing, like, the click of your finger hitting go publish is not something that you're going to find on a PDF workbook. It's just not. Yeah. So awesome. I love that. Well, of course we're… Of course we're friends because we totally agree on that, so. Um, okay. What is a bill that you are weirdly proud to pay? Um, my, for my managed IT services provider. So when we first started working together, we did a trade. We are each other's clients. I am weirdly, weirdly proud that we, we both said to each other, we were like, "We should pay full value for this," you know? Like, instead of doing… Like, I would invoice him the difference. Um, so I'm weirdly proud to pay. So he does quarterly billing cycles. I have my antivirus, I have anti-phishing, um, and scanning on my email address, on my emails. Um, I have backups of my Google Drive, my iCloud, everything, third-party backups for all of that stuff, which saved my ass when my laptop died a couple years ago and Take The Leap files were on that, and I was like, "Oh, fuck. It's not like we can re-record this shit." Yeah, the ba- the backups existed. Um, what else is in there? Um, I don't have to worry when my lap- when I'm out and about places, if my laptop is out, I have GPS tracking on it that will kill the entire thing, or I can go locate it with the police. Same thing on my phone. Um, so yeah. So all of those, I mean, it's, it's not a small bill. It's be- around, I think it's around 1,600 every… Well, it's more than that. I think it's, like, 1,800 every four months, right? Yeah, quarterly. Um, but I'm proud of it because it covers all of the, you know… Um, oh, I also get dark web monitoring too, so I would know if my shit was sold on the internet. So yeah, it's, I'm very proud to pay it for it because it also helps me with my peace of mind that if, uh, when I see quarantined files in my little antivirus, I'm like, "Ooh, what the fuck did I try to download? Like, what, what did I almost, like, kill my computer with?" So person who has said that this is the bill that you're weirdly proud to I'm really curious what other people said. Um, it's been all kinds of things from like SaaS products to, um, service help that they have or life things that they're paying for. And, um, yeah, it's like the things that matter to us. It's really interesting. But, but like you are scaling, you have clients, and you're protecting your clients' data on top of it, and I just think that is such a huge selling point. So if they don't know that that's part of what the infrastructure of you is giving them, Oh, yeah. Oh my God, the number of people who try to share their passwords in the wrong way. I'm like, "No, don't email that shit to me. Don't text it to me. Please use this one time," it di- you know, like the one-time link or whatever. And they're like, "Oh my God." I'm like,"And you wonder why you got hacked month." Like, come on. Yeah. don't do hacking around here. No, no, no. Um, all right. We're, we're having everyone finish the season by doing a Mad Libs sentence, so I'm gonna have you fill this in. It starts, "My business pays for my life, and that means," fill in the blank. Uh, my business pays for my life, and that means I get to do whatever the fuck I want. Like, I'm weirdly proud of, like, being able to fire clients when it doesn't… You know, you know, like you, you can't fire your boss ever usually at, like, nine-to-five jobs. Um, but also, you know, if I decided tomorrow that I want to m- um, start making tarot cards out of all of the Take The Leap episodes, like I could just… I, and that is on my wishlist. Um, that's why I'm saying it out loud, and you saying yes just validates that. Um, but you know, like I could just decide to do that tomorrow. And, um, I also found out this really cool thing in, um, Nevada is that w- a single LLC can have five entities under it, five separate entities under it, which is pretty cool. So I'm like, I got three…'Cause I'm planning on putting Take The Leap under one of them. I was like, "I got three more things to play with that don't have to have the same name as my business." Um, so yeah. So I think, I mean, we know serial entrepreneurs out there, but once you're at, once you own and operate your own business, it is so easy to start something new when the wind direction takes you there. And that is, I think, one of the m- the most fun things to have the validation about, because I really do wish I had started this earlier. I started at 35, um, and I was giving myself till I was 50, uh, to be able to work full-time in my business. I love it. Well, you left a the fif- the, yeah, yeah. I was like the 15, the 15 part was right. It was just months, not years, you know? So, so yeah. Uh, I love it. You set such a good, you set such a good example for people and, um, I know that you've inspired at least someone by hearing this episode. So yeah, uh, I am making sure everyone knows that all of your information is in the show notes, and they should definitely go subscribe for updates. They should definitely listen to the podcast you do with Tory and listen to Take the Leap because you have so many amazing people on that podcast, and I just love how interesting and varied all the people are that you invite on. And, um, you guys have been absolute workhorses doing it, and the content producer in me salutes the content creator in you. Ah. Well, uh, shameless plug for the Dojo and what Mary does. If I did not follow you to fricking Podcast Movement in Denver to record season one of School of Moxie after, after I moved away to the desert. Um, you have taught me so much about how to do a podcast. Like, I just shamelessly was like,"Oh, we're allowed to do this." So I've used a lot of your production to- you know, pre-production tools and things like Thank thank you for s- setting the stage and making it possible with School of Moxie season one. Yeah, that was such a special season to do. It was such an unexpected thing. People still are like, "What? Those things don't go together." And then they listen to the podcast and they're like, "Oh my God, 'The Last of Us' is a business story." And yeah, so yeah, I really thought that I was gonna go back to making content, being a content creator who gets paid for making content, and then in the course of doing that was like, "Wait, how come I couldn't get a studio up here?" And now there's keys, and I have paid for them for an entire year as of today. That's right. Oh my gosh. Yeah, 'cause right around now we were starting to plan, um, uh, this time last year I was actually coming back from San Diego for the first time, but we were planning to come up there in August to grace the studio for season three, the beginning of season three Yes. Yeah, and there's, there was boxes everywhere, everywhere, and like the camera's at this terrible angle and like… And I was like,"Screw it. We're just recording." We're just doing it. We're just doing it. You know what? And that is a tribute to everything does not need to be perfect to put something out No, it really doesn't. And I just love creating alongside y'all. Like, it's so good. Yeah. It's so fun. So, all right. Here's to many more. I'm sure we will be trading more episodes again in the future. This is not the last, um, but, but I will remind everyone to go into the show notes and connect with you because you're a badass dude. That's it for this episode of the School of Moxie podcast. This season was produced and edited by me, Mary Williams, through Sensible Woo and now Sasquatch Media Grounds out of Vancouver, Washington. If you're a business owner and you want help building your own media engine, maybe it's your podcast, your YouTube channel, your content, the whole visibility machine, come and subscribe to my emails at sensiblewoo.com/subscribe. I'll show you how it's done, and I'll hook you up with the good stuff. See you on the inside